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> He's out & baby pic., ....People cover...
Lozzenger
post Sep 23rd 2008, 9:58 PM
Post #101



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now now, no need to start your fantasies girls just because clay's out of the closet whistling.gif rolleyes.gif




clay+jesse shifty.gif


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KCCAFan4Ever
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:00 PM
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QUOTE(Lozzenger @ Sep 23rd 2008, 9:58 PM) *

now now, no need to start your fantasies girls just because clay's out of the closet whistling.gif rolleyes.gif
clay+jesse shifty.gif

Who? I'm lost. unsure.gif

I think we need a thread in Clay Off Topic on who we would love to see Clay date. haha.gif shifty.gif


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Diane
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:02 PM
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Brian the Bible says "effed up" things? that's your opinion. I happen to follow it, so... I know it isn't cool to have morals or any sort of religion, but I don't care what anyone else thinks.

Clay's autobiography and Rolling Stone interview lied to us, guess everyone will just look past that though. Whatever, this is an "anything goes" society so I guess you all will support anything and everything.

This post has been edited by Diane: Sep 23rd 2008, 10:06 PM


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maggithemagpie
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:08 PM
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To those who feel stupid for defending him this whole time...DON'T. Think of it this way: you were believing the best about him. Now, don't get me wrong. I'm not saying that being gay is bad or that he;s a bad person or anything. I am keeping my personal views on the whole thing to myself, lol. I'm just saying that if someone calls another person gay or accuses them of something without proof, and that person denies it, I'm going to believe them until I see actual proof that shows otherwise. I'd rather do that, then accuse someone of something and be wrong about it. How would you like to be straight and continually accused of being gay and always having to defend yourself? That can't be any fun and so if someone tells me "I'm not gay," I'm going to drop it. I'm not going to accuse them or make them discuss the issue. I'm going to just believe them until they want to tell me otherwise, and if other people give them a hard time, I'll defend that person to the end because if the accusations are false, I sure as heck don;t want to be a part of that. I'd rather believe the best about someone and be wrong than to believe the worst and be wrong (or right). Not saying that Clay being gay is "the worst" thing to happen, but I hope you all understand what I am trying to say.

And if people really are upset about it because of faith issues, then just pray for him. And remember to show some mercy and grace. Even when Jesus was being crucified, he said "Father FORGIVE THEM for they know not what they do" so if he can forgive the ones who were crucifying him, then I think you can forgive and show some mercy towards Clay for not being totally honest.

This post has been edited by maggithemagpie: Sep 23rd 2008, 10:11 PM


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KCCAFan4Ever
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:13 PM
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QUOTE(Diane @ Sep 23rd 2008, 10:02 PM) *

Brian the Bible says "effed up" things? that's your opinion. I happen to follow it, so... I know it isn't cool to have morals or any sort of religion, but I don't care what anyone else thinks.

Clay's autobiography and Rolling Stone interview lied to us, guess everyone will just look past that though. Whatever, this is an "anything goes" society so I guess you all will support anything and everything.

This is another reason why I haven't said anything about some part of me believing he's gay. I'm a Christian. I have morals, but I believe The Bible contradicts itself a lot. Let's not forget that it was written by man through God, so there could have been some influence from those men that they wrote in The Bible.

Like someone said earlier, he could have been under some contract with AI that told him he could only talk about certain things. Or, more probable, he was afraid of the fan reaction. He was just starting his music career and probably didn't want to hurt it by actually saying anything.

All in all, we don't know what Clay was thinking cause none of us know him and I'm sure he wouldn't want to tell his fans EVERYTHING about his personal life. I, for one, have things I don't like to reveal to people unless they are very close friends of mine. I'm always going to be a fan of Clay's, through the good and bad, because his music is what captured me first and has kept me sane for the past 4 1/2 years.


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snl89
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:20 PM
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Diane-

so... you honestly don't believe that ANY part of the Bible could be at ALL influenced by, oh, say the prejudices of the people who wrote it? Because, after all, even Christians agree that, even though the Bible is the WORD of God, it wasn't written BY him, right?

I just think that when you stand back and look at it logically, God- at least any God I'd personally WANT to pray to- would not preach UNacceptance. He would not condemn an act that is done purely out of love and that is not hurting anyone. But PEOPLE- PEOPLE have a natural fear of the unknown. And in the end, no matter how holy you may consider the Bible, it's still a BOOK. A book written by PEOPLE, and one that could have been influenced by those people inner fears and prejudices.

There's just no REASON that any God worth praying to would forbid an act that only spreads love and NO hate or cruelty whatsoever. Not in my opinion, anyway.

Besides, according to the Bible aren't people who commit adultory supposed to be stoned to death? We don't follow THAT rule, do we? So why push the "homosexuality is not allowed" idea to the extreme? Oh yeah, that's right. It's because it makes people more UNCOMFORTABLE, so they use the guise of religion to allow their prejudices to continue running strong, instead of actually DEALING with it and learning to ACCEPT and UNDERSTAND people who might be "different", and now it's so deeply rooted in some people that they don't even have the ability to stop and think "wow, I don't actually have any REASON for believing this, except that it's what I've always been taught and told to believe" original.gif

(sorry, I really truly don't mean to bash you. This is all just my belief. And I'm CERTAINLY not trying to imply that you're any kind of bad person just because you believe what you do. I just can't help but suggest that perhaps the beliefs on which you've been raised have provided you a more narrowminded view of reality)


sorry, this is all getting kind of.. unrelated to Clay haha. But yeah, yay for Clay!! grin.gif

This post has been edited by snl89: Sep 23rd 2008, 10:23 PM


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Brian.
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:21 PM
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QUOTE(Diane @ Sep 23rd 2008, 10:02 PM) *

Brian the Bible says "effed up" things? that's your opinion. I happen to follow it, so... I know it isn't cool to have morals or any sort of religion, but I don't care what anyone else thinks.

Clay's autobiography and Rolling Stone interview lied to us, guess everyone will just look past that though. Whatever, this is an "anything goes" society so I guess you all will support anything and everything.



Puhlease. I know you aren't playing that card. I probably have more morals and for sure more knowledge of the Bible than you ever will. rolleyes.gif And who's to say I don't believe in the Bible? You don't have to totally reject its universal, valuable teachings just because you prefer not to take the outdated, heavily influenced by early-inmanyways-backwards-cultures parts literally.

But unlike me, you follow every bit of it, word for word?

QUOTE

Deuteronomy 23:1
No one whose testicles are crushed or whose male organ is cut off shall enter the assembly of the Lord.


QUOTE
1 Corinthians 14:34
Women should be silent in the churches, for they are not permitted to speak, but should be submissive, as the law also says.


QUOTE
1 Corinthians 11:13-15
Judge for yourselves: Is it proper for a woman to pray to God with her head uncovered? Does not even nature itself teach you that if a man has long hair it is a disgrace to him, but that if a woman has long hair, it is her glory? For her hair is given to her as a covering.


....and my favorites:
QUOTE

"Slaves, obey your human masters with fear and trembling, in the sincerity of your heart, as to Christ."
(Ephesians 6:5)

"Slaves, obey your human masters in everything; don't work only while being watched, in order to please men, but work wholeheartedly, fearing the Lord." (Colassians 3:22)

"Slaves are to be submissive to their masters in everything, and to be well-pleasing, not talking back ." (Titus 2:9)

"Slaves, submit yourselves to your masters with all respect, not only to the good and gentle but also to the cruel. " (1 Peter 2:18)


There you have it. There are more instances in the New Testament that God instructs slaves to obey their masters than there are condemning homosexual acts. How many slaves do you own, btw? I hope they're good Christians (under your definition of the word) and are obedient to you.


This post has been edited by Brian11785: Sep 23rd 2008, 10:35 PM


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Lozzenger
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:28 PM
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QUOTE(KCCAFan4Ever @ Sep 24th 2008, 1:00 PM) *

Who? I'm lost. unsure.gif

I think we need a thread in Clay Off Topic on who we would love to see Clay date. haha.gif shifty.gif



jesse vargas. but maybe i'm the only one who's on that train tongue.gif


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<3=clayton
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:28 PM
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^Well, she's not posting at IDF ever again, so I hope she at least lurks to see what you both just wrote.

It's sick, in my opinion, when religion hinders your musical tastes. SICK. But whatever. Clearly you believe in a book. That's cool. I don't believe you're justified. That's just me. original.gif


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KCCAFan4Ever
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:32 PM
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QUOTE(Lozzenger @ Sep 23rd 2008, 10:28 PM) *

jesse vargas. but maybe i'm the only one who's on that train tongue.gif

You'll have to send me a PM with a pic of him to refresh my memory of what he looks like. whistling.gif


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BlakeAceFan83
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:36 PM
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Good for him,now he doesn't have to lie anymore.


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FiRsT_2-lAst
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:39 PM
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He looks so adorable! Spikey hair! eep!

and I'm beyond happy for him : )


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~SilverGirl23~
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:44 PM
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Diane, I respect freedom of religion and I don't think anyone has the right to judge another person's beliefs. However, I do have an issue with hypocrisy. Do you grocery shop on Sundays (the Sabbath)? Do you believe drooling over your neighbor's new Mercedes is a sin? These are Biblical teachings. If you don't follow these teachings, then what gives you the right to judge someone else who doesn't follow every Biblical teaching? I guess I'd rather have someone just honestly say "Homosexuality creeps me out." than play the religion card.

I found a great article from 1994 that said the following:

Yet, when I hear people condemning homosexuality on the basis of the Bible, I wonder whether they also accept the rest of the Bible's many views about what is right or wrong in human behavior and, if not, why they make an exception for what it says of homosexuality. Do they agree, as Deuteronomy commands, that individuals who commit adultery should be put to death or that the clothes they wear must not be made of more than one sort of material or that dissolute sons should be stoned to death? Or with the Old Testament's acceptance of polygamy? Or with Jesus' emphatic prohibition of divorce found in Matthew?

http://www.humanistsofutah.org/1994/art2feb94.html

This post has been edited by ~SilverGirl23~: Sep 23rd 2008, 10:45 PM


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ChaCha919
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:46 PM
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QUOTE(KCCAFan4Ever @ Sep 23rd 2008, 10:00 PM) *

Who? I'm lost. unsure.gif

I think we need a thread in Clay Off Topic on who we would love to see Clay date. haha.gif shifty.gif



I'd like to see T.R. Knight (George) from Grey's Anatomy,lol bleh.gif heart.gif


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watsofunny
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:49 PM
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tongue.gif Ah Clay, I just love how you liven up a place!

No shock or surprise either way here. My fandom has always been about the man and his voice, not his sexuality. It still saddens me that people feel they have to reveal their sexual orientation though. Why should it be anyone's business. Good for him that he's finally secure in himself. Hugs to the man. This will certainly separate the true fans from the.....well, not so true ones. thumbsup.gif


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Brian.
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:53 PM
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QUOTE(ChaCha919 @ Sep 23rd 2008, 10:46 PM) *

I'd like to see T.R. Knight (George) from Grey's Anatomy,lol bleh.gif heart.gif


Why not an Idol alum? He'd have literally dozens to pick from.... haha.gif


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Ashleah
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:54 PM
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ph34rwave.gif

Well, I'm glad he finally did it because I know it has to be a weight off of his shoulders. I am a little bummed considering he denied it for so long and I always stood up for him to anybody that said he was gay... even though it doesn't matter now because I stopped listening to his music a long time ago (sorry, no one jump on me or anything). I can guarantee you now everyone's going to be like, "SEE ASHLEAH WE TOLD YOU SO!" ermm.gif I hope that no one will stop listening to his music on this account because if so that's extremely hypocritical - if in the Bible being gay is a sin, so is lying, cheating, stealing, etc. - in which case we shouldn't be listening to anyone, even ourselves singing in the shower. happy.gif

On a side note, I was reading some of the Biblical arguments going on here. It was mentioned that the Bible was written by men and would contain prejudices and biases. I know of a verse that directly deals with that subject so I thought I would share it along with a footnote.


2 Timothy 3:16 (Holman Christian Standard Bible) All Scripture is inspired by God and is profitable for teaching, for rebuking, for correcting, for training in righteousness,

Footnotes:

1. 2 Timothy 3:16 Lit breathed out by God; the Scripture is the product of God's Spirit working through men; see [2 Pt 1:20-21].


Interpret it however you want, just thought I'd throw it out there.


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*~AJ_luver~*
post Sep 23rd 2008, 10:57 PM
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I've always had that sense that he was. Still doesn't change how much I love Clay as a singer or person. happy.gif

I"m so glad that his hair is back! w00t.gif THANK GOD! hahaha. spaz.gif

What was funny was that, I decided to listen to all the MOAM songs today, I was in such a rock music mode for so long. It was quite refreshing. haha. Totally offtopic, but whatever. hehe.

This post has been edited by *~AJ_luver~*: Sep 23rd 2008, 10:59 PM


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stranger
post Sep 23rd 2008, 11:04 PM
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QUOTE(Lozzenger @ Sep 23rd 2008, 11:28 PM) *

jesse vargas. but maybe i'm the only one who's on that train tongue.gif



I'm very happy for Clay. What a relief for him, now he can live his life without worrying about a grand scale cover-up. Good for him.

As for who he should date--Rufus Wainwright, definitely. Without question. I've thought it for years actually.



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maggie
post Sep 23rd 2008, 11:05 PM
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I've been a fan since day one and that will never change.

As an aside, read at the CB that Clay didn't make an appearance at the stagedoor. Apparently, there were a lot of papparazzi with cameras and mics at the ready but also quite a few fans who were bombarded by the "reporters". Doesn't take them long to crawl out of their holes when they smell a story.


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